Accessible Disruption - Strategy Table

David Becker: [00:00:00] I am working with founders and, and founding teams or teams that are in the early, early innings, um, to build a business teams that either have a great vision or a great product or, you know, perfect world, also great teams and a combination of all of that.

Podcast Host: The world is changing. For most human beings, change is uncomfortable and challenging to address. Whether you are a startup working on agile processes or a mature organization, navigating change within existing complex structures, the mindset and skills to adapt has never been more vital. The team from the strategy table want to help the wider world understand the need and approach to meaningful and impactful change management, helping organizations navigate disruption and make change accessible to [00:01:00] everyone.

This is accessible disruption.

Anthony Vade: Welcome to another episode of Accessible Disruption where we. Stare bravely into the abyss of change management and ask it to scream back at us. Before I introduce our next guest for this episode, uh, I will like to remind you all to share this episode. Like it of course. And don't forget to subscribe to get notifications of future episodes, additional resources that accompany this will be available by our website with the link in the description.

So without any further ado, joining us today is the perfect kind of guest for accessible disruption. David Becker is an award-winning tech founder, media strategist, and go-to market leader with 20 year plus track record of engaging audiences and ramping revenues. As co-founder and former CEO of Kister, the preeminent software for guest list management, David [00:02:00] has worked with major global brands like the Oscars Noble Peace Prize, FIFA World Cup, and thousands more across media, entertainment, art, fashion, and professional services.

Swiss born, so you're gonna get another interesting accent. Uh, and New York City based David guides growth companies into the world's largest markets. And this quote, uh, by JB Miller, uh, the president of Empire Entertainment stood out to me on the website. David is a transformative force blending entrepreneurial acumen, product development expertise, and venture building proficiencies to drive impactful change.

Tira, I can't think of a more perfect guest to be on our show. Uh, and. As so often is the case, you, you set up this connection with David. So before we ask him to jump into his fascinating world, could you perhaps share with us a little bit of your personal experience with David and perhaps, uh, prompt him with your first probing question?

Tahira Endean: I. Huh? Absolutely. Well, let me just say David Becker is one of the people who [00:03:00] saved my sanity as the world flipped into covid. So he was the CEO of zip ster and part of the, uh, journey that they had was realizing. Goodness. We are an event ticketing company and there is no event. So what are we gonna do about that?

And they had the year before had celebrated their clients with a really fantastic book that were about the world's best events. And so I actually have it right here. I'm not gonna take it down 'cause everything will collapse, which this is an audio podcast and it'll just create a lot of noise. So we met because he wanted to continue to expand on the world's best events and connected with me on LinkedIn and from there.

We really just found that we had a lot of things in common and grew a community, the world's best events through that time, which truly just was a lifeline and was also a really great study in how do you adapt. And so as we started to build this podcast, I just knew that David was somebody we [00:04:00] had to have on.

He's always fascinating to talk to. So David, welcome.

David Becker: Thank you for having me.

Tahira Endean: We are excited. It's been a while now. We're, you know, far past all of those days. The pandemic is behind us. We have a whole new thing happening. Uh, you've moved on into your career and you are really working as a strategic advisor and supporting really young tech companies now.

So tell us a little bit about that experience.

David Becker: I mean, I think it all builds on, on the, the, the 10 years before I started now working with, with other companies. I was the co-founder and CEO of Skip Stir. And, uh, that taught me how to build or bootstrapped assess technology platform. Uh, it also taught me that things can change from one day to another.

Like you said, it was around March 9th or so. In 2020, we lost 90% of traffic, revenue, everything in like one or two days. Um, we built this community and, uh. We, we, we had a lifeline and the business came back. And when it was back, it was time for me to move on. And [00:05:00] figuring out what that meant was pretty disruptive to me.

Like, I was like at first, okay, what do I do now? I came from media. I became kind of almost an accidental tech founder. And, um, I, you know, after a while I realized, okay, I can, what I know best is, you know, building tech businesses. So. I am working with founders and, and founding teams or teams that are in the early, early innings, um, to build a business teams that either have a great vision or a great product or, you know, a perfect world, also great teams and a combination of all of that.

And, um, trying to gauge kind of what awaits them because I went through it and, uh, but you know, so only so much you can also say because, um, most people need to. Need to live it.

Tahira Endean: Lived experience is definitely something that is part of the change management process, isn't it, and certainly have a growth process.

What are you finding are some of the biggest barriers to [00:06:00] change?

David Becker: Well, if you're in a, an early stage, let's say seed round, pre-series a environment change is actually program like there's, you know, every day is change. Because you need to find market validation, product market fit, and all of that. And what's hard is that with every piece of information, things technically can completely pivot or should completely pivot.

But you need to identify the right piece of information, right? And it, if you know, you cannot pivot every day, otherwise you have. Instability. We can see that now in the markets at this very moment in time. So instability is never great, but you need to be agile. So what is that balance and how do you strike that?

Balance is very tough. And then also. The leaders I'm working with, how do they then break it down to their teams who potentially not even realized what they signed up for? So this is a multifaceted, right? Like one thing is to get the leaders ready to deploy the right [00:07:00] resources and take the right decisions in moments of change.

And then also like, let it pan out and like bring everybody into the boat. And that usually takes a bit, you know, you can't go that fast. People need a bit of time to adjust. Um, so you cannot. Enforce it, but in the same time you have to, so that's the balancing act.

Anthony Vade: It's almost like you're forced to manage a team environment with vastly different focuses and attentions and what's important to them.

You know, we've talked about a lot about flexibility of focus. What's the big picture goal that we have? Long term I. Revenue driving normally versus what are the short, incremental steps we're trying to achieve in the details? You know, the fine details, the iterative cycle of developing a product, testing the market to, to your point, the, the tech industry and the startup industry is known for being scrappy.

Right? You bootstrap, we get out there, we just move fast and break stuff. Whereas the business world tends to be a bit more conservative and a bit more risk [00:08:00] adverse. Having gone through this yourself and, you know, developing products and then bridging that. Gap. Uh, what do you think is the biggest challenge in being adaptable enough in your communication style to enable the scrappiness to happen when it has to, but get things back on track in a business sense, when, when you need to transition into that kind of conversation.

David Becker: Probably a case by case decision, like, and it also depends on. In, we're in the business, you know, like in in the tech development part or the UX and the product development, you can be very iterative. Like that's built into the process, right? Like two weeks sprints where engineers build towards, um, a few tasks that they have been given and they know in those two weeks, most likely nothing will change, but they don't know what comes after the two weeks.

So I think in. In the development, it's pretty straightforward, but then like in marketing and sales, it's a bit different, right? Like does the value proposition change every three months? [00:09:00] Maybe in the beginning. And how do you now make sure that people. Click and they're like not using the wrong talking points because it changed the third time or the fourth time.

And so, you know, the, the sooner you find your clear precision messaging, obviously the, the better it is because yeah, people only have so much bandwidth to bring it forward.

Anthony Vade: Would it be fair to also say that you know, a lot of executive leadership, uh, type mindsets as well, they find comfort and stability in that value proposition.

So if you are going to them constantly changing that, they may get a bit more anxious. Whereas if you can lock that stuff down a bit earlier, it gives you a bit more freedom for the backend tech side of things to be more iterative and maintain that trust that you are still on a path that you set out, or is that completely off base?

David Becker: I mean, the problem with the value proposition development, it is, it's a dance between, um. Needs and wants and pains and gains, and that comes [00:10:00] from customers or prospects. And if they're not buying in, if you have the wrong customer buyer persona or you're not really solving a problem for them, you're just, you're just a vitamin.

There's only so much you can do. Right? So you've rather find that out faster rather than. But then too late, because you might have to change the entire company. You might have to change the entire product and completely go into a different direction. But it's, it's a struggle. I've been doing it for a while now, uh, you know, as a decision maker and now more as like the advisor.

And it's hard. You never really know. And I've come from media. I come from the newsroom where you act super fast. So I'm by nature a bit too. Jumpy. Um, and, but then other people, you know, come from other, uh, other backgrounds and then they're just not at all agile. So, you know, it's also a, it's also a job for me to find the right balance and to counterbalance the people I'm working with.

Maybe they're jumpy too, so we need to calm it really down. Right? Or [00:11:00] maybe they're just really stubborn and like really set on one direction and maybe we need to break that up a bit and, and it's like, show a bit agility.

Tahira Endean: So one of the things that we've really been looking at with the strategy table as facilitators of change is finding that time when it makes sense to bring in a, an us to say, okay, so team, you know, you're on this path.

How are we doing? And hey. Do you really know your team? Like, have you, you know, taken some time to think about, you know, not just the skillset that you've hired them for, but how people work together and how people work together differently? Because every time that you're iterating requires a lot of collaboration to get to innovation.

But if you are only knowing the sort of surface level of people and you are having people follow a path that. Isn't really a true clear North star, but it's kind of a muddy [00:12:00] galaxy of maybes. Um, you know, to have a tool or a set of tools to bring in some clarification, bring in some collective design iteration and help refocus.

Do you ever see the companies you're working with thinking about taking that kind of a step?

David Becker: I mean it, it really depends on what people want. And is it a match of like the leadership gives the North Star and then the people sign up for this and sometimes there's a mismatch there and sometimes there's a match.

So to your point, the clear, the North Star, the better. Right? I'm working with a media company in the impact space. It's clear we changed 250 million lives. So the people. In the whole chaos can just look at that star and be like, I don't know how we're gonna get there. But that's the marching order, right?

They're there for the impact. Maybe in another company. It's just revenue. I. [00:13:00] And maybe they're not that money driven and then it's a mismatch, or they're very money driven and that's the right north star for them. So I, I would probably look at like if I was you guys coming in, like what kind of people are sitting around the table and is that North Star aligning with what they can deliver or what they want in life?

Anthony Vade: To build on that with another question, do you think organizations are putting enough time into. Discovering who their team is at that depth of level or, or, or should they be investing more? And maybe I'm leading the witness. Um,

David Becker: but

Anthony Vade: I don't

David Becker: know. I mean, in, in corporate, and I've wasn't really ever in corporate, so I just old from hearsay, right?

There's a lot of assessments and this and that. So that's where they, I feel like these jobs are, you know, just part of the systems and it's part of the talent development. I don't know what it means whether then they, they execute it the right way. In the startup world, you just don't have time. No chance, right?

Like, so picking the right people and sort of finding the right mix [00:14:00] is even more important because you don't have money or time to train them and to give them the leeway to get where they need to go. If you only have three months runway, you better have the people to execute on that three months to raise another round or to get the breakeven.

It's quite binary.

Anthony Vade: If we then shift our perspective and think about the leader hiring those people, like the, the depth of trust they have to put in them. Very quickly to deliver on whatever they've been hired to and maybe even identify blind spots could certainly bring about a bit of vulnerability in that leader's mind that, you know, I've only just met this person, but we gotta go at breakneck speed.

Would you agree with that? Is that something you've seen? How does someone such as yourself help a leader navigate building that team and bringing the best out of them?

David Becker: That's a tough one, but I would probably, I would start thinking of like, bring the best people that you can. And like, not like the best match to this culture.

Like you, [00:15:00] you need to win, gotta bring the best. And then you make sure that these best, best people fit in somehow. And at that, you know, you don't completely derail the thing because now you have different cultures and all of that. And I'm also working with American startups, European startups, startups from other regions.

Wow. Complete di like we're in the remote world, like in every call you have. You have a call of five people, you have three nationalities, you have two motor tongues. Three motor tongues. Like this thing got really complex. So I really, when it comes to building something and succeeding, it's pretty binary.

Like, gotta bring the best people and figure out the rest later.

Anthony Vade: Yeah. Especially if you want that pace, right? If you, if you want to move very quickly. They need that competency. I think, I think that there's a trend, um, in the business world to say, Hey, culture over everything else, and all the catchphrases culture eats strategy for breakfast and all the other cheesy lines that people give.

But we keep saying at strategy table that one [00:16:00] size fits all does not fit all, unfortunately. And, and when you need that, uh, you need that speed and you need that agility. The competency plays a very important role.

David Becker: I once asked a friend who built a successful business when I was in the stage or when we were in the stage of maybe five people or something.

I asked, and he was like, further, he is now a billion dollar business. He was at like a hundred, and I asked him like, how do you build culture? How does it, how do you do that? Then he's like, you're the culture. And I didn't get it at that point, but it's true. And so it's who you pick to work with, how you work with them and your value, how you treat them.

Are you transparent about the issues and the successes? Are you just celebrating all day, although kind of the whole thing, tanks, you know, and you don't tell anybody? Or is it the other way or just negative and, but you know, it comes from you. And so you have to find the right mix as a leader, and the rest I think will fall in place if you have capable people.

To my point with the best, right, [00:17:00] the rest will fall in place.

Anthony Vade: Let's take this opportunity to take a short break now and hear from some of our sponsors, but of course, if you want to hear this ad free, along with extended versions, access to our book club and the chat community. You can visit strategy table.co or click on the link in the description.

We'll be right back.

Podcast Host: Our world is changing. For most human beings, change is uncomfortable and challenging to address. Keeping up in a competitive business environment requires confidence in your team's. Adaptability, leaders are expected to lead adoption initiatives, evolve team member skills, and build resilience with intentional change management strategies.

But even the most seasoned leader or executive. Can find it challenging to get things started on the right foot [00:18:00] and in the right direction. Engage with Strategy Table to kickstart your organization's change management and continuous improvement initiatives. Address and elevate your team's agility and build a confident innovation culture.

Make your team feel and believe in the shared responsibility supporting each other bravely and boldly into the future no matter what it has in store. We are not your average consultants. We are skilled guides helping you elevate your team's thinking, and turn it into impactful doing. Find more information@strategytable.co.

Tahira Endean: If you said, I've seen a hundred leaders, how many of those hundred leaders have you seen that you know, were actually natural leaders who had the charisma and the inspiration in the vision and the humility to [00:19:00] truly be leaders of exceptional companies? And then, you know, what can be trained?

David Becker: I was never part of a huge success.

So you could say, well, I have never met these, that leader, or I was never that leader. But then you can also say, well, I was part of building. Sustainable company and feeding families and creating great lives in great circumstance. So that is also an achievement, but like, I guess my question is what does it mean a truly a exceptional leader?

For what? For like, for like a juggernaut at the stock market or for just a really good, nice, great community. Delivering company.

Anthony Vade: Once again, that's tending us away from this one size fits all or one blanket approach to even leadership at that point because, uh, a different, a different product set, a different marketplace, a different stage of a company's lifespan requires a very different leadership approach as well.

And I guess a certain [00:20:00] amount of willingness from that leader to be. Agile in how they address wherever they are. And that's why you see CEOs transition in and out at different times based on what the fit is for where that company needs to be, uh, in that time and place. You mentioned earlier about that sort of startup mentality and how you've been working with teams that are now transitioning that product from that bootstrapy into being real businesses.

Um, have you got any insights to sort of professionalize the approach outside of that sort of scrappy startup into the more business-minded, more corporate direction?

David Becker: I can't give you a perfect answer. It's so

Anthony Vade: hard.

David Becker: There aren't perfect answers

Anthony Vade: to anything. It's fine. You're

David Becker: building, you're building these.

Processes, right? Too early, you're gonna completely suck the oxygen out of the room and you're just gonna cripple the whole thing. If you're too late and too late back, you're gonna create a lot of friction and people will leave and like you'll derail. So it's kind of [00:21:00] probably the same thing here. It's pretty agile, like, okay, you know, let's, let's try, let's bring this.

Task management system here, you know? But then what I see often, or like at least in in companies, that that are also led with, not necessarily founders, but people that come from corporations, is that it gets over engineered, right? In early stage. You cannot over engineer. I. But you should start engineering, right?

You should bring this collaboration tool, but maybe a simple one, you know, maybe one that just does a couple of things and a bit of a Kanban board, and then you run with this for, for a year or two, and then you outgrow it. You will know, and then you bring a more elaborate. Complex process in place, but what you can do is just over-engineer the process in the beginning or never do anything.

But again, it comes back to leaders, right? Like I'm working with one leader that is like, let's get the revenue. I don't care about any process until we have certain level of revenue. And that's also a fair way of looking at the world. It really depends on [00:22:00] what you as the executive. Wish for yourself. Do you want to maximize your net worth?

Do you wanna win the category? Well, then you have to act differently. Um, and, and maybe break more stuff, including what we just discussed or do. Are you, do you want to, you know, are you maybe a little bit more humble and a bit more. More sustainable and you just want to create a strong niche product, um, then you have a bit more time to build and see and just organically grow.

Organic growth is not as tough than anything else. And if you take venture capital and you're inorganic or you acquire, then it gets tough. But you know the upside's there then,

Tahira Endean: and there's a place for all kinds of companies in the world.

David Becker: But I do think in the world we're in, it makes sense to be so somewhat in the middle and a good economic driver creating jobs, but also a great contributor to the community.

Because [00:23:00] we have enough examples that the Fringe is doing just one of the things

Anthony Vade: and understanding death by process that you mentioned, um, and, and, and understanding that you need to be agile in that approach to make sure that you don't fall into those pitfalls. Ha, have you come across any interesting ways to, to look at how leaders can manage the sort of three key elements to any form of change?

Right. Are often the tool sets that you give them. The process and the business within which they need to work. Everybody loves to talk about that stuff. How can I optimize my collaboration space? Um, the attitude that they need. They need to believe. You mentioned that before. They need to understand the vision and where they're heading.

And at the end of the day, the behaviors. That they need to adopt the things they actually need to do. I think we tend to focus heavily on the process and the tools to do the job, and we tend to neglect the attitude our teams have and are they actually doing the behaviors in [00:24:00] the way that we expect them to do it.

How do you approach those sort of three key areas of the tool sets our preoccupation with it, the emotional and attitudinal effects that we need, and then the behaviors that we want to drive.

David Becker: I think the tool sets we talked about. I think what's interesting is the attitudes or the behaviors, and I can make one example.

Uh, maybe because I have a Swiss background, it's a bit, it's typical that I would mention time, but being on time, right? I was never really that great being on time when I was younger and also just like learned it the hard way. It wasn't the best, and I'm still sometimes a minute late, but then I'm like, whoa, now I'm late.

I think if a leader, um, wants to have a, a functioning company and wants people to like deliver. They need to deliver more than anybody else. Be on time every single time. And then only then you can ask people to be on time. Right. If you're constantly three, four minutes late. Oh, but [00:25:00] sorry, like another call and can't, you can't say no to clients to like move over.

It's, it's 59 and you can't wiggle out. And now the next call, 17 people or six people had to wait for five minutes, do the math. Due to math, you just destroyed $2,000. So like have your behaviors understand what. What you're doing and start small stuff.

Tahira Endean: I think that's really important what you just said about the modeling of the behaviors because there is definitely in the world still that, you know, do as I say, not as I do.

And at the end of the day it's really, it's people will do as you do.

David Becker: Yeah. It goes back to culture, right? You are the culture.

Tahira Endean: Yes. And the culture, you then,

David Becker: that's not just startups, even in like corporate teams, like team leaders. You're the culture.

Tahira Endean: You are the culture. Um, when we talk about culture and people say, oh, that, you know, it was all ping pong tables and kegs of beer and that's not a culture.

So what [00:26:00] would be some of the things that you are seeing in the work that you're doing that are some successful culture touch points?

David Becker: The ping pong tables were war for talent and so is work from home. The, the most talented people you know or engineers were rarity. Now, yeah, it's changing unfortunately for the engineers.

But before there was a rarity so you had to give them a ping pong table and nowadays if you're a super talent, you can work from home and everybody else has to go to the office. So like it really depends on what the demand and supply of work capital or human capital is. Um, that will then lead to kind of.

The incentive structure around it. But I would give people an opportunity to work from home if they have young kids and if that's good for them or if it's good for them to go to the office because they have young kids, they'll let them do that. Like just be a bit contextual. But like here, you know, again, I.

I don't know how to build a billion dollar business. Maybe you just have to be an asshole and just like force people [00:27:00] in five days a week. I can't give you that answer, but I think I would just look at it contextually and do what's best for your people. Give them the leeway, give them the trust, give them the time, give them the flexibility, and, and then measure whether it pays back.

And the ones that don't pay back, like, well, they're not for you to work with. And the ones that will pay back. They're your people and then they will stay with you for a long time. Like CTO I'm working with, he was just bumped the other day because one of his engineers that came from an agency was pulled off the project and he's like, nah, I got the guy to the, you know, the way I wanna work with him.

Once you have a good working relationships, it's priceless. So how do you maintain that? You're just. Making sure that you're good with the people and give them what they need.

Tahira Endean: When I was finishing my Master's in Creativity and Change leadership, I did a very big project taking a company through a change where it was a great way to really see how people were feeling.

Um, because then [00:28:00] the executives weren't involved, it was done virtually. It was done using the mural tool, which meant people could really. Anonymously get out all of their thoughts, but then still in a group setting look at all of those thoughts collectively depersonalize how they were feeling about what the change was gonna have to be.

And then start to address where they saw the barriers and where they saw the opportunities. And we don't do that enough in organizations. Uh, we tend to just assume that everything is just humming along fine. Or you fill in your Viva goals or your, you know, chart of things, but instead of a leader just saying, how are you feeling about this?

Um, and we shouldn't be scared to do that as leaders, but I think sometimes it's not even a fear. Sometimes it's an expectation. I just assume everything is fine when sometimes it might be great, and sometimes it might be fine, and sometimes it might be not very good. But you [00:29:00] need to be able to gauge where that may be, because every business is cyclical, especially with technology, because you're always on a, on a wheel of, you know, it has, you're always on a continuous improvement.

Go to market, make it better. The clients have, you know, come in with 73 new questions of things that they desperately need to have. How do we continue to iterate? It's hard to keep that momentum going. Without stopping to check in with people.

David Becker: I think the lifespan of a company is also important to understand for, you know, facilitators like yourself or the executives in the company.

Sometimes it's maybe unclear, right? Like if you're in a 12-year-old tech company with 400 employees, you most likely are already playing defense. But you don't know yet, right? Like all these other incumbents are trying to eat your, you know, breakfast, complete different skillset and attitudes needed than when you play offense.

When you're [00:30:00] the, you're the challenger. You're a year or two years old, you have the latest technology or tech stack, super agile. You got the hungriest engineers going after the incumbent, right? Like you, you have to understand what you sign up for. Like I keep signing up for these early guys and it's pure chaos and I wonder what the hell I'm doing.

I just find it interesting and I can learn the most there, and I tend to go where I can learn the most.

Tahira Endean: That's

David Becker: also a thing, right? Like what's your personal North Star? For my, for me, I found out like I need to still learn.

Tahira Endean: I think you can do two things and. That you can learn the most, but because of the experience you have, you can also offer the most.

So it becomes a win on both sides, which is when you become successful as a strategic advisor is because you're, if you went in and said, I'm the strategic advisor and I know everything I. You wouldn't be successful because you would be going with a set of assumptions that isn't very realistic.

David Becker: No, and thank God there's ai.

You can talk to AI when you [00:31:00] don't know anything, or you can tell people, Hey, I don't know, what do you think? And then sort of develop it together. It's okay. Fine. Nobody knows everything and it'll just be like upfront about it. We're in like 20, 25. It's not the old world where we like have to wear a gray suit and a tie and lie about our skills anymore.

Tahira Endean: I love that thinking actually, uh, we cannot, at some point I. Your lies will be caught out, so you might as well. And it doesn't set for a collaborative environment if you're not willing to be a collaborator.

David Becker: Yep.

Tahira Endean: So, and I think that that's nobody's successful alone.

David Becker: One word about the event industry as a tech supplier, you know, I was selling into the industry.

We were selling injury, we knew them really well. And I have to say in hindsight now that I'm not doing that anymore, I'm not in touch with that industry. It's an incredibly, a agile industry. The people in there are resilient and they know like it comes in like waves and the big events coming and all hands on deck.

And then the post event like slowdown [00:32:00] comes like that. Like industry is amazing and I always thought it was amazing, but like now looking back at it and being in other sort of corporates, you know. Sales calls with other functions, the event

Anthony Vade: guys are like incredible to back that up as well. I like, I've come across so many people in organizations that used to be in vent departments and they've shifted into other departments within the corporations because they have that agile mindset and they have that ability to experiment, uh, a little bit more.

How should we wrap this thing up to here? How do we want to put, put a little bow on this conversation.

Tahira Endean: Well, gosh, I'd truly like to hear from David. If you were a strategic advisor to a young company, like say the strategy table, what would be a piece of advice you'd like to leave us with?

David Becker: I mean, understand your user buyer persona.

Really, really understand deeply, deeply their problem. And don't be afraid to find a niche and relate where the problem is kind of even more special and then specialize on it. That [00:33:00] niche needs to be big enough to pay your salaries, but like really, really go out there and help people, you know, do their jobs.

Um, don't think. That that's what they need, and then kind of tell 'em what they need and it won't work. Do it the other way around.

Anthony Vade: Thank you for validating a lot of our mindset. Make us feel a lot more comfortable with that. Any closing thoughts from you, tehir?

Tahira Endean: Thank you, David. That's my closing thought.

Yes,

Anthony Vade: thank you.

Tahira Endean: I'm always, uh, have always enjoyed any conversation with you because it makes me think differently and that's what I love thinking differently.

David Becker: I, I like. Getting people to think differently somehow. I, you know, I'm still looking for the perfect job to do that, but I figure sort of like in the strategy space, it's probably the best and more like on the human side rather than on the Excel spreadsheet side, which is also has, its, has its, uh, room in the, in the strategy space.

Anthony Vade: Yeah, I mean, both are important. [00:34:00] David. We're gonna share your details in the description of the podcast as well, and, and, uh, certainly encourage people to reach out to you if they're looking for assistance in the space. I would like to thank you as well and hit the audience up with a call to action that, uh, these conversations are great fun, but they are.

Pointless if we don't take action with them, and we don't make change in our world by utilizing these amazing, great ideas. So we invite you to continue listening to this podcast series, connect with David, connect with us online, and please keep this conversation going because, uh, we wanna see some positive change in the world and that will come about.

By having conversations like this. And with that, we'll call it wrapped up for another episode of Accessible Disruption and we'll see you on the next one.

Podcast Host: Accessible Disruption is written and spoken by Tahira and Dean Ryan Hill and Anthony Vade. All content is developed in collaboration with the team at Strategy Table [00:35:00] Podcast production by Experience Design Change, Inc. An association with the change lead network. Find more information@strategytable.co.